Let's play a game

Drangonfly , 7/31/2023, 8:51PM(291 days ago) @hopeyougogirl

Let's try to defend Liam without bringing up Tom. We know what Tom has done. Yes he's a villain. Yes he's not redeemable. Yes Hope is nuts to fall for him.

But in a post about Liam, can we try to talk about Liam without bringing up Tom? Can Liam be defended on a stand alone basis or is it that the only way to make Liam look good is to bring up someone worse than him? If so then it just proves the point that Liam is really not a very good person if he stands alone without any comparisons. Bringing up Tom does not magically make Liam a saint.

Just my two cents.

Well, here's my two cents for what it's worth.

For the most part, Liam falls under the heading of the "good" guy. Why? Because he tries to do the right thing. Unfortunately, in trying to do the right thing, he makes a complete mess of things. It's seldom intentional, it's simply an act now in the moment mentality. Seeing the big picture is not Liam's forte. He's what you would call short-sighted. But, his heart is usually in the right place.

Liam is protective to the max, most likely because he was the one who had to take care of his mom when she was dying. That experience most likely resulted in a "rescuing people to his detriment" kind of cycle. When he was with Hope and thought he had gotten Amber pregnant, he tried to do the right thing by sticking by Amber. When he saved Steffy from drowning, he was caught up in preventing his dad from hurting Katie. When he fought with his dad over Bill's treatment of Sally, he was trying to right the wrongs he perceived were unjustly aimed at Sally. When he married Ivy to keep her from being deported, he prioritized Ivy's needs ahead of his own. Liam unconsciously forms a white knight kind of attachment to people that he can't seem to break and that comes at a cost. He stays with Amber, Hope is hurt. He feels bad for Steffy because of what happened with his dad, Hope is hurt. He fights for Sally, Steffy is hurt. He marries Ivy, Steffy is hurt. Liam's history is littered with choices that make one person happy at the expense of another but in that moment when the choice is made it's all about the person standing in front of him. Again, he has no thought about the hurt that may result. He only thinks of the happiness he can provide in the moment. The rescuer tends not to see beyond the moment.

Liam's behaviour and actions after Beth's death really demonstrated the type of person Liam is. Despite is pain and suffering, he put Hope's needs ahead of his own. His love for Hope was never more apparent than during that time. His sole focus was Hope. And, even though Hope put him through hell, he didn't waver from their connection as a couple. '

Now, the weird thing about Liam is how intuitive he can be. Obviously, it is situation specific, but he can read a room like no other. He has an uncanny ability to sense that something is off. He knew something was off about Beth's death and he fought tooth and nail to find the answer. He knew that Thomas was up to no good and he went the extra mile to save Hope. He saw through Bill in the Sheila situation so much so that Bill nearly confided in him. Knew something was up with Hope. Knew something was up with Finn.

Liam has a big heart and it shows in his interactions with Douglas in particular. I am a sucker for a dad and son moment and no matter how bratty or difficult that kid can be, Liam loves him like he's his own. Without a doubt, Liam has loved that boy and done more for that boy and than any other male in Douglas' life.

IMO, Liam suffers from a bad wrap. Doesn't matter how many times Liam has apologized and owned his mistakes, and he has countless times, and it doesn't matter the years of his prolonged loyalty to people, I find the expectations placed on this character are far greater than any other character on the show. He is expected to demonstrate unwavering allegiance. He is not allowed to show weakness. When he makes a decision and stands by it, he is admonished for being selfish and unyielding and unforgiving. It's always a lose/lose for Liam. No matter what he does, it's wrong.

None of that explains his tendency to not want to be alone for even a second. If it's all about the person standing in front of him, does it make no difference that the person is married to someone who considers him a friend? I know you explained that he apologized and so the matter is over, but fact is that the matter is over because Steffy shut him down. History has shown that when Steffy is willing, Liam does not hesitate to use her any way he wants. Honestly, I was starting to like Liam after how loyal and faithful he was to Hope. I even mentioned in a couple of posts that I couldn't believe I was defending him. But when push came to shove he showed once again that he hasn't changed one bit. The story is extremely poorly written in that Hope should have taken a stand when Liam was actively spending time/talking about/having some connection with Steffy. But the issue on which Hope took a stand is not nonexistent. Liam himself proved it not two seconds after Hope kissed Thomas. An apology only works when the person apologizing realizes that their behaviour should not be repeated. But Liam apologizes and then repeats the same behaviour, over and over and over again. He has been called out on at least three different occasions by three different women, Hope, Steffy and Ivy, on this issue. But in the next moment they are all back to fawning over him and forget completely why they called him out. And as a result Liam never changes. I'm pretty sure the same thing will happen with Hope this time. And that is what is so frustrating for this viewer. Stop calling him this wonderful, decent, amazing guy. I've seen for myself what he is like and I don't need it shoved down my throat that he's a catch when that simply is not true.

But NONE of the main guys on this show is considered a "catch", so not just Liam. All these men have their own flaws..everyone one of them. JMO.

Tell me which other guy is repeatedly referred to as a "good person" and someone who the parents keep pushing their daughters to be with? Even Thorne, who was genuinely a good guy, didn't get any of those accolades.

Waffling king Ridge has been shown referred to as a "good person" by Brooke, Taylor and others.

Point taken. But it's the same story as Liam I'm not very happy with Brooke either for taking him back after all her grandstanding.

Unfortunately on this show..when it comes to these male characters, I as a viewer have to set low expectations. JMO.

Yup. That's what you have to do if you want to ship a couple on this show. It's pretty sad, really.

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"I love you more than anything or anyone in the world. And I want you by my side for the rest of my life."

"You're the love of my life."

Liam to Hope. Debate over.

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